Elrenniel

noun. 'Daughter of Elrond'

prop. n. #'Daughter of Elrond'. Elrenniel << Elrendiel << Elrondiel << hel-Elrond << Elrondhel.

iell

daughter

1) iell (-iel) (girl, maid), pl. ill, 2) sell (i hell) (girl, maid), pl. sill (i sill), coll. pl. sellath**. **DAUGTHER OF TWILIGHT, see NIGHTINGALE

iell

daughter

(-iel) (girl, maid), pl. ill

sell

daughter

(i** hell) (girl, maid), pl. sill (i** sill), coll. pl. *sellath***. **

sellath

noun. all the daughters

elerondiel

feminine name. *Daughter of Elrond

A name of Arwen (PE17/36). This name appears to be a compound of Elerondo (probably the Quenya name of S. Elrond) and the feminine patronymic suffix -iel “-daughter”, since Arwen was in fact Elrond’s daughter.

Conceptual Development: The name was first written as (rejected) Elerondorel, using the same feminine patronymic seen in Tindómerel “Daughter of Twilight”. This change reflected Tolkien’s ongoing vacillation over the proper Quenya word for “daughter”. See the entries for yeldë and seldë for further discussion.

elerondorel

feminine name. *Daughter of Elrond

A (rejected) name for Arwen. See Elerondiel for discussion.

-iel

daughter

-iel patronymic/matronymic ending -"daughter" (YEL, VT46:22-23) In the Etymologies, Tolkien struck out this ending and the corresponding independent word yeldë "daughter", changing them to -ien, yendë. However, the ending -iel later turns up in later forms: Uinéniel "Daughter of Uinen" in UT:182 and Elerondiel "daughter of Elrond" (Elerondo) in PE17:56. Hence it would seem that Tolkien changed his mind again and restored this ending, and perhaps the noun yeldë along with it. The form Elerondiel (from Elerondo) demonstrates that a final vowel is omitted before -iel.

seldë

noun. daughter, daughter; [ᴹQ.] child [f.], *girl

This seems to be the word that Tolkien favored for “daughter” in his later writings (PE17/170; VT47/10; PE19/73), though it had competition from other forms like Q. yeldë.

Conceptual Development: The earliest word resembling this form was ᴱQ. sui “daughter” in the Qenya Lexicon of the 1910s under the early root ᴱ√SUẈU (QL/87), a word also mentioned in the Poetic and Mythological Words of Eldarissa (PME/87). This became ᴱQ. silde “daughter” in Early Qenya Word-lists of the 1920s (PE16/135).

In The Etymologies of the 1930s, Tolkien experimented with several different forms. He had ᴹQ. yelde “daughter” under the root ᴹ√YEL, but this entry was deleted (Ety/YEL). Tolkien also had a root ᴹ√SEL(D) “daughter” with a derivative ᴹQ. selde, but the meaning of this root was changed to “child”, and masculine and neuter forms ᴹQ. seldo and ᴹQ. selda were added to the entry (Ety/SEL-D). Finally, under the entry for ᴹ√YŌ or YON “son”, Tolkien added a primitive feminine variant ᴹ✶yēn or yend “daughter”, producing ᴹQ. yende and (suffixal?) yen (Ety/YŌ).

These vacillations continued in later writings, where at one point Tolkien wrote “Q[uenya] Wanted: Son, Daughter” (PE17/170). In Notes on Names (NN) from 1957 Tolkien wrote Q. sel-de for “daughter”, but above it he wrote a variant form anel. In rough notes from around 1959 Tolkien explored a large number of masculine and feminine suffixes, and on the page he had yeldë “daughter”, though at the end of the sentence he wrote “also yen” (PE17/190). In notes on Eldarin Hands, Fingers and Numerals from the late 1960s, Tolkien wrote selyë as a diminutive/affectionate word for “daughter”, with seltil as a play name for the fourth finger representing a daughter (VT47/10, 27).

Also of note is Tolkien’s Quenya name for S. Tinúviel “Daughter of Twilight”, which he generally represented as something like Q. Tindómerel < ✶Tindōmiselde. Tolkien was fairly consistent in this Quenya form starting in the 1930s (Ety/SEL-D; PE19/33), with examples in the 1950s (PE19/73) and 1960s (VT47/37) as well. Indeed, in a couple cases he used this name to illustrate how medial s generally became z and eventually r in Quenya (PE19/33, 73), so it seems that for this name Tolkien consistently imagined the primitive form for “daughter” as ✶selde.

Neo-Quenya: I’d assume selde is the main word for “daughter” for purposes of Neo-Quenya, but I’d assume a variant form yeldë, especially since -iel was the most common suffix for “daughter of”. This variant probably arose very early under the influence of √YON “son”.

-ien

daughter

-ien fem. ending in certain names like Yávien, Silmarien (q.v.) At one point -ien implied "daughter", see -iel above.

anel

daughter

anel noun "daughter" (PE17:170), possibly intended by Tolkien as a replacement for seldë (q.v.). Compare anon.

selyë

daughter

[selyë noun "daughter", used in children's play for "fourth finger" or "fourth toe" _(VT47:10, 15, VT48:4) _It is unclear whether it was the word selyë "daughter" itself that was rejected, or just its use as a play-name of a digit. Compare yeldë, yendë.]

yeldë

daughter

yeldë noun "daughter" (YEL) This word was struck out in Etym, but it may have been restored together with the ending -iel, q.v.

yen

daughter

yen, yendë noun "daughter" (YŌ/YON). This word replaced another form, but this form may have been restored; see yeldë. In VT45:16, yendë is said to refer to a female "agent", a word changed by Tolkien from yendi, but Tolkien deleted all of this.

anel

noun. daughter

A transient word for “daughter” in Notes on Names (NN) from 1957, written of above the more common sel-de (PE17/170).

yeldë

noun. daughter

A less common Quenya word for “daughter”, an analog of Q. yondo “son”.

Conceptual Development: In The Etymologies of the 1930s Tolkien had ᴹQ. yelde “daughter” under the root ᴹ√YEL of the same meaning, but the meaning of the root was first changed to “friend”, and then the root was then deleted (Ety/YEL). Meanwhile, under the root ᴹ√YŌ or YON, Tolkien introduced a feminine variant ᴹQ. yende “daughter” along with (suffixal?) yen, derived from primitive ᴹ√yēn or yend (Ety/YŌ). Previously this yende/yendi form was a feminine agent, but Tolkien rejected that meaning (EtyAC/ƷAN).

In between yelde >> yende for “daughter” in The Etymologies, Tolkien considered using the form ᴹQ. selde, and in later writings this seems to be his preferred Quenya word for “daughter”. However, yeldë “daughter” was mentioned again briefly in rough notes from around 1959 (PE17/190), and -iel remained Tolkien’s preferred suffix for “daughter of”.

Neo-Quenya: For purposes of Neo-Quenya, I recommend seldë as the more common word for “daughter”, but assume yeldë also exists as variant due to the influence of yondo “son”; see the entries on seldë and the root √YE(L) for further discussion.

Elerondo

star-vault

*Elerondo masc_. _name "Star-vault", Sindarin Elrond. Extrapolated from Elerondiel "daughter of Elrond", patronym of Arwen (PE17:56); cf. Elerossë, rondo.

ye(l)

root. daughter

The root √YEL was one of several competing Elvish roots for “daughter”. In The Etymologies of the 1930s ᴹ√YEL “daughter” was first used as the basis for ᴹQ. yelde/N. iell “daughter”, but it was deleted (Ety/YEL). N. iell was given a new derivation from ᴹ√SEL-D “child”, by analogy with N. ionn “son” (Ety/SEL-D), while a new Quenya word for “daughter” was introduced: ᴹQ. yende from a feminine variant ᴹ√yēn of ᴹ√YO(N) (Ety/YŌ). Note that ᴹ√SEL-D itself was initially glossed “daughter”, but was changed to “child” and given derivatives for all genders in Quenya: ᴹQ. selda [n.], ᴹQ. selde [f.], and ᴹQ. seldo [m.].

The picture in later writings is also rather muddled. In Notes on Names (NN) from 1957 Tolkien gave sel-de “daughter” (PE17/170), while S. sel(l) = “daughter” appeared in both the King’s Letter from the late 1940s (SD/129) as well as the Túrin Wrapper from the 1950s (VT50/5). The diminutive form for “daughter” appeared as Q. selyë in notes from the late 1960s (VT47/10). In several places Tolkien gave Q. Tindómerel “Daughter of Twilight” as the Quenya equivalent of S. Tinúviel, with the final element being derived from primitive ✶-sel(dĕ) > -rel (Ety/SEL-D; PE19/33, 73; VT47/37).

In this period, however, the more common suffix for “daughter” was Q. -iel as in Q. Elerondiel (S. Elrenniel) “✱Daughter of Elrond” as applied to Arwen (PE17/56) and Q. Uinéniel “Daughter of Uinen” (UT/182). Furthermore, in a list of masculine and feminine suffixes written around 1959, Tolkien gave (primitive?) yē, yel and (Quenya?) yelde for “daughter”, though in that note the feminine patronymic suffixes were revised from {-yel, iel, -yelde >>} -well-, -uell-, -wend-, -wel, and yen was given as another variant (PE17/190). In other notes from the late 1950s associated with “Changes affecting Silmarillion nomenclature”, Tolkien had feminine patronymic suffixes -en, -ien, but said that Quenya used -ielde, -iel (PE17/170).

Neo-Eldarin: All of the above indicates considerable vacillation between √SEL, √YEL, and √YEN for “daughter” words and suffixes in the 1930s to 1960s: of the three Tolkien seem to favor sel- for “daughter” words but -iel for “daughter” suffixes. For purposes of Neo-Eldarin, I would assume ᴹ√SEL(D) originally meant “child”, with √YEL an early variant meaning “daughter” under the influence of √YON “son”, especially used as a suffix. However, due to reverse influence Q. seldë and S. sell were early on used to mean “daughter”, with female child = “girl” words becoming Q. nettë and S. neth.

iell

noun. daughter

iell

noun. daughter

Stated to be an alteration of sell , remodelled after ion "son" (OS *jondo). It was "a change assisted by the loss of s in compounds and patronymics", hence the ending -iel in several feminine words

sell

noun. daughter

iell

noun. girl, maid

Stated to be an alteration of sell , remodelled after ion "son" (OS *jondo). It was "a change assisted by the loss of s in compounds and patronymics", hence the ending -iel in several feminine words

sell

noun. girl, maid (child)